tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post2604384048062770130..comments2024-03-26T05:15:39.663-07:00Comments on Equestrian Ink: The Ongoing DilemmaJami Davenporthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05259390150273030284noreply@blogger.comBlogger16125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-28005245120397541282014-05-24T16:57:51.965-07:002014-05-24T16:57:51.965-07:00WHP-Yes, Gunner still has "a positive outlook...WHP-Yes, Gunner still has "a positive outlook." I had him out for a while today to groom him and let him graze and he is quite perky. But he is getting more lame. I really do struggle with "when."Laura Crumhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15200878892304748308noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-30946379883611153312014-05-24T14:59:55.997-07:002014-05-24T14:59:55.997-07:00I've seen several horses kept alive too long -...I've seen several horses kept alive too long - and not by people like you, Laura. You've been around horses a long time, think hard about what is right, consult others, and aren't afraid to make a hard decision. It's the people who 'collect' horses and think that putting them in a field is enough that concern me. And the people who always 'know best'. <br /><br />When I had the old stallion put to sleep, he'd become less mobile over a period of weeks and began to lose muscle condition on his bad leg. I was able to make a judgement that his quality of life had deteriorated. Until then, although unsound, he had what I can only call (trying not to anthropomorphise) a positive outlook. White Horse Pilgrimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18256903307281225327noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-24697949571978230742014-05-23T08:00:26.115-07:002014-05-23T08:00:26.115-07:00Thank you, Pattie, Merri and Kate. I know you unde...Thank you, Pattie, Merri and Kate. I know you understand. I do feel, as Pattie says, that Gunner is enduring the aches and pains that old age brings humans as well as horses, and, as my vet said, "I have a bad knee that hurts, too, and I don't want to die because of it. I don't like to put these old horses who are bright-eyed down because they are a bit gimpy."Laura Crumhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15200878892304748308noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-10271707934280022242014-05-22T03:37:16.239-07:002014-05-22T03:37:16.239-07:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Bryan Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15419297282520630115noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-17757094530920370742014-05-21T18:32:59.238-07:002014-05-21T18:32:59.238-07:00There is no right thing - there is only the best y...There is no right thing - there is only the best you can do. You are a knowledgeable and caring horse owner, and whatever decision you make, and whenever you make it, it will be OK.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-89336926889567381582014-05-21T16:18:01.567-07:002014-05-21T16:18:01.567-07:00oooooh I feel every word you said. I am not lookin...oooooh I feel every word you said. I am not looking forward to the time I have these same thoughts and wonder about the right answer with my horse. <br />hugs!!!!<br /> - <a href="http://theequestrianvagabond.blogspot.com/" rel="nofollow">The Equestrian Vagabond</a>The Equestrian Vagabondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15600011873327347121noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-9018347252868024932014-05-21T15:39:13.753-07:002014-05-21T15:39:13.753-07:00Aches and pains are part of growing old, the crone...Aches and pains are part of growing old, the crone stage of life as it were. He doesn't sound like he is ready to let go of this life. Wince with him but let him enjoy his time until he is ready.Pattiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18093706178631084468noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-4980580850521204062014-05-21T10:48:25.760-07:002014-05-21T10:48:25.760-07:00Thank you all for your comments. I really apprecia...Thank you all for your comments. I really appreciate your insights.<br /><br />Aarene--I haven't actually dodged emergencies--Flanigan's colic, Burt's stroke and Toby's need to be euthanised that day were all emergency calls to the vet. However, I guess I feel differently about that context. For me there is comfort and rightness in knowing for sure that my loved animal is ready to let go of life--and that usually involves a sudden decline of some sort, which pretty much means an emergency call. I'm also very proactive when I'm sure. Both my old dog Jojo and our pony Toby were scheduled to be put down on the day that they were actually euthanised, but when I felt the timing needed to be different--in one case sooner, in one case a little later that same day--I called the vet and made the change happen.<br /><br />In the long run it's not about me and what's more comfortable for me. It's about the animal and what I think the animal wants. I do my best to give them what I would want for myself.<br /><br />I also believe--and I don't know this for sure nor do I wish to imply that others should believe this--that animals let go much more easily when they are ready to go. I have actually never had an animal (after many, many cats, dogs and horses) fight the drug. But I have known of several cases where this happened and every single time it was an animal that I would not have chosen to put down, feeling that the animal still enjoyed his/her life. <br /><br />BEC--I respect your point--that's the part of me that argues for "A." <br /><br />Paige--I understand what you are saying. I have to say, though, that your horse's end sounds about right to me. I have had two horses lie down like that and it seemed to be very clear that they were ready and it gave me much comfort to know this. It is also much easier on horses if they don't have to fall (so says my vet--and based on my own observations I completely agree). I would be at peace if it worked out for Gunner as it did for your horse.<br /><br />I also know my own life will be much less stressful when Gunner is gone. I will miss him very much, but my day-to-day life with the horses will be very much easier. I cannot find it in my heart to let that be my primary guide. It's a part of what I understand, but for me the choice needs to be based on what I think Gunner wants.<br /><br />Martine and Alison--I thought that I would put Gunner down this past winter because he would be unhappy in the storms and mud, but we had a very mild winter and he did well and actually gained weight. But yes, if he looks miserable this summer, that will be the tip off. Having him at home means I can easily put fly spray on him every day and such, so it is easier to give him a good quality of life. If he were still in the pasture where I used to keep him, he would have had to be put down this last fall.<br /><br />Robin--Yes, I have vets on call. And just as jenj and ChristinaRae also said, I am going to follow my instincts. I have learned over time that this is the bottom line.<br /><br />Thank you, all of you. I appreciate your thoughts.Laura Crumhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15200878892304748308noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-41335852139639572652014-05-21T07:04:13.295-07:002014-05-21T07:04:13.295-07:00From what you have described, B should still be wi...From what you have described, B should still be winning. If you do not believe Gunner is "telling" you it is time, do not second guess that instinct. When he stops eating, no longer greets you,etc, then it will be time. Just be sure to have a vet on call for when the time comes so it can be fastRobinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15409004219738609732noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-57078265353916230202014-05-20T22:40:27.436-07:002014-05-20T22:40:27.436-07:00You have the knack of describing things so well an...You have the knack of describing things so well and I'm sure this post struck a chord with loads more people than just me.<br />I've gone through this internal debate with our dogs and with one cat, but never with a horse. It's so difficult to make the call, but I do agree with Brown-Eyed Cowgirl that it's better to be too early than too late. How much too early is up to you... but it sounds like it's not time yet for sure. Maybe you'll see him struggling with the heat & the flies in the summer and that'll help you make the decision.<br />Whatever you do, and whenever you do it, I hope it goes smoothly and peacefully for your sake as well as Gunner's.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-7547630722021894412014-05-20T20:05:51.560-07:002014-05-20T20:05:51.560-07:00We owned a Tennessee Walking horse that was at lea...We owned a Tennessee Walking horse that was at least 35 when we finally put him to sleep. The vet said that he was "as old as dirt." :)<br />The thing is.... Sometimes I wish that we had put him down before we actually did. He had always done good, kept good weight, was happy,etc. But two weeks before he died, his arthritic legs did cause him to fall. And while he got up, he was very different. (The vet suspected a stroke after the fact.) He still ate, still acted happy, but he stumbled more, and was much stiffer than he had been. <br />The day we had decided to put him down he let us know that he was ready by laying down two hours before the vet was slotted to arrive, and not getting back up. When the vet finally showed up, it was all over within five minutes. <br />It was so hard, but I will also be honest... I was also so relieved. That makes me feel so heartless, but I spent so much time worried about him, not wanting to go anywhere in case he layed down and couldn't get up, or in case he was extra stiff one day. I missed his presence, and his personality, but I did not miss the worry and stress...<br />He was not the first of my horses that we have had to put to sleep, but he the only one that I feel that we waited to long. <br />It makes me feel better to remember that horses don't view death like we do. They don't fear it. I think if I were to go back I would put my horse down, before it got to the point that I HAD to. TwoChestnutshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11258633247705367320noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-15370731856825872532014-05-20T19:21:12.057-07:002014-05-20T19:21:12.057-07:00I have always believed that the kindest, most lovi...I have always believed that the kindest, most loving thing we can do for our horses is be brave and smart enough to make the decision to put them down before they lose their dignity. The very last thing on earth I think a well-loved horse needs is to suffer, even the slightest at the end.<br /><br />And Yes, I have made the decision, many times...sometimes if feels like too many times already in my life, to put a horse down that maybe could have had another 6 months or a year of a decent life. But at what cost to them? Horses don't think about end of life like we humans do. <br /><br />My personal consolation is that I would rather be 6 months too early, rather than one day too late. BrownEyed Cowgirlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03610547057139295854noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-26724764338143351102014-05-20T18:26:20.571-07:002014-05-20T18:26:20.571-07:00I've learned (the hard way, of course) that pr...I've learned (the hard way, of course) that pragmatic is best...for me, and for my life. The loss of a friend is traumatic enough if it s a quiet, planned event, surrounded by friends (the vet is a friend) when I have time and energy ready.<br /><br />Loss is much harder for me when it's an emergency. Sometimes, maybe, I've chosen to let a friend go a day or a week early, in order to avoid an urgent "get here now" emergency. I don't think emergencies do anybody any good. You've managed to dodge emergencies thus far, since you say that you've always been able to know "exactly when." That's lucky. I hope your luck holds forever...but I'm too cowardly to take that chance. AareneXhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18072169739345465380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-756292896241195762014-05-20T18:22:29.608-07:002014-05-20T18:22:29.608-07:00I do the same thing, every day, with my old guy. I...I do the same thing, every day, with my old guy. It's not easy, and I don't have any answers other than trust your instincts. You'll know, and when you do, you'll be certain.<br /><br />Many hugs from those of us at Wyvern Oaks. jenjhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01737679332792618499noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-40459984086071449442014-05-20T18:22:24.367-07:002014-05-20T18:22:24.367-07:00You know horses. You know your horse, especially, ...You know horses. You know your horse, especially, you've had him for decades. If you're still able to argue with yourself about it, it's not time. You'll know.ChristinaRaenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5037107797013641705.post-53341101691258082932014-05-20T16:35:42.731-07:002014-05-20T16:35:42.731-07:00I have a stronger pragmatic side when it comes to ...I have a stronger pragmatic side when it comes to aging animals, but your conversation (which I loved) shows that the emotional side should win at this point. Gunner will tell you when he's ready. And perhaps bad weather (too hot/dry this summer, too cold this coming winter) will also play a stronger hand. <br /><br />Alisonhttp://www.alisonhartbooks.comnoreply@blogger.com